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Evangelical · 05-16-2018, 03:03 PM

I can understand this interpretation, but it means little without a solid definition of the church.

A genuine church is a local church (church in Ephesus, church in Corinth etc). Geography is the only thing that should separate believers.
Each genuine local church in Revelation symbolizes a particular condition of the genuine church. So one church in one city may be Sardis, and another may be Ephesus, it depends on their condition.
Jesus never told anyone to come out of these churches, but to overcome - "to him who overcomes". If we stand as a local church, then our job is to overcome the degradation in our church. It is not possible to leave a local church unless we change our geographical location.
But if we stand as a denomination, then the call is to come out of her. The old Reformers saw the Roman Catholic church as Babylon. Later, these reformed churches became Babylon when they became worldly and denominationalized. Babylon is the false church, or worldly church system.

Simply, it reduces to this:
If we are in a local church (a local church is one which has the locality as its identity), we overcome.
If we are in Babylon (a church which does not have locality as its identity), we leave.

Notice that I have defined Babylon not by its condition but by its identity. That is, suppose the Episcopalian church did not incorporate Beyonce into the church services, suppose they were 100% biblical to the letter. They are still Babylon because they are defined by Episcoplainism or the English Monarchy (historically), which is a worldly mixture.

In the time when Revelation was written, maybe there was a sect in Sardis for example which was more perfect than the church in Sardis. This sect called itself "Sardiscopalian", and their head was the Roman Emperor because the Roman Emperor thought he was the God-appointed head of the church in his country (just as the English monarchs thought the same and established the Church of England).
But they are not a genuine church because they are not local and do not have a lampstand. So they are Babylon.

05-16-2018, 03:03 PM	#3
Evangelical Member Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 3,965	Re: Poor, poor Christianity... I can understand this interpretation, but it means little without a solid definition of the church. A genuine church is a local church (church in Ephesus, church in Corinth etc). Geography is the only thing that should separate believers. Each genuine local church in Revelation symbolizes a particular condition of the genuine church. So one church in one city may be Sardis, and another may be Ephesus, it depends on their condition. Jesus never told anyone to come out of these churches, but to overcome - "to him who overcomes". If we stand as a local church, then our job is to overcome the degradation in our church. It is not possible to leave a local church unless we change our geographical location. But if we stand as a denomination, then the call is to come out of her. The old Reformers saw the Roman Catholic church as Babylon. Later, these reformed churches became Babylon when they became worldly and denominationalized. Babylon is the false church, or worldly church system. Simply, it reduces to this: If we are in a local church (a local church is one which has the locality as its identity), we overcome. If we are in Babylon (a church which does not have locality as its identity), we leave. Notice that I have defined Babylon not by its condition but by its identity. That is, suppose the Episcopalian church did not incorporate Beyonce into the church services, suppose they were 100% biblical to the letter. They are still Babylon because they are defined by Episcoplainism or the English Monarchy (historically), which is a worldly mixture. In the time when Revelation was written, maybe there was a sect in Sardis for example which was more perfect than the church in Sardis. This sect called itself "Sardiscopalian", and their head was the Roman Emperor because the Roman Emperor thought he was the God-appointed head of the church in his country (just as the English monarchs thought the same and established the Church of England). But they are not a genuine church because they are not local and do not have a lampstand. So they are Babylon.