Quote:
Originally Posted by Nell
These "concepts" were not put forth by me, therefore, the burden of proof does not fall to me. For now, i will think of them as “straw verses” or “straw concepts.”
Also? You haven't provided verses to back your "verses". I'm not asking Coreopsis ... I'm asking you. Please substantiate your, as yet, non biblical Christian teachings.
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You have already provided one verse on which I elaborated. My post is a reply to Coreopsis. If I am asked to provide bible verses then they should be as well. Coreopsis has made some serious "accusations" (or at least implications) about local church members and all based on their concept of true repentance and conversion which they gave without biblical support.
If you want to be fair you should also ask Coreopsis to present their bible verses for the following concepts:
"true repentance" - this concept is not clearly found in the bible. People either repented or they didn't. There is no case that I can think of where an apostle said to a new convert - "did you truly repent? maybe your repentance was not true, do it again, try harder!"
"being taught how to repent" - can repentance be learnt or taught or is it something we just do when confronted by a holy God? Again, learning or teaching repentance may not be biblical.
"repenting before God" - what does "before God" mean? When people came to John to be baptised they seemed to repent "before John".
"true repentance leading to true conversion" - that true conversion must be preceded by true repentance may not be the case. This is a long standing debate in Christianity about how a person is saved. Must they repent first or repent later, do they have to repent at all, or does repentance just occur once a person receives the Spirit or believes and confesses Christ? Is repentance simply a change of heart or must a person make a thorough audible confession of all their known sins to be a "true convert"? Must a person cry and sob for it to be genuine repentance or is no tears okay? Can you believe first and repent later?
I'm happy to explore all these from the bible if you want, but leave the Googling to me okay? I do a much better job. I mean, on the one hand you are asking me for bible verses, meanwhile asking Coreopsis to Google and not doing such a good job of it yourself because you only returned a CS article and I found lots of references, over 100.