Quote:
Originally Posted by Drake
Igzy>”As I've said, Apostles like Paul no longer exist. The Bible clearly says the Apostles of that time had seen the Lord Jesus and were able to work miracles. (1 Cor 9:1; 2 Cor 12:12). Neither Witness Lee nor any workers in the LCM nor anyone else I know have such credentials or power. They do not have the signs of an Apostle that the Bible specifies.
The original Apostles had special authority. They could direct churches, they could define the faith, they could author Scripture. No one in the modern age has such power. The Bible has replaced them. ”
Igzy,
Several arguments you present here have no scriptural foundation. Its fine if you want to believe them but they are not biblical facts.
For instance, there is nothing that says apostles have to have seen the Lord and work miracles. Timothy is the obvious example of a NT apostle that does not meet that definition.
Again, the original 12 Apostles and Paul for instance, cannot be replicated, I agree, however there is no scriptural basis for saying there are no apostles at all.
There is no basis to say the Bible replaced the function of apostles.
And you if you hold that apostles have been replaced by the Bible then why not Evangelists also? Why stop there? Why not Shepherds and Teachers?
Drake
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Igzy,
Yours was a reasoned response so I wanted to offer a response in kind.
In this post I will address the first of your assertions that NT apostles are determined by those who have seen the Lord. That, is the 12 Apostles and Paul seem to be the focus of your argument, as if they alone alone were qualified to be apostles because they had seen Him.
In another post I will discuss the criterion for evidence of NT apostles, that is your assertion concerning miracles and works of power.
In another post I will address your assertion that the Bible replaced the function of apostles.
So to the first point above..... there are recorded in the New Testament the mention of apostles who did not see the Lord in person. Only one is needed to dispel that idea so I offered Timothy. Yet, we find several other apostles mentioned: Silvanus ( 1Thess 2:6) , Ephaproditus (Phil 2:25), Andronicus and Junia (Romans 16:7), Titus and others (2Cor 8:23).
Do the 12 original Apostles hold a special place? Yes as evidenced by the foundations of the New Jerusalem with their names on it (Rev 21:14). Are they and Paul the only apostles in the New Testament? No, as shown in the verses mentioned above.
So, when were these other apostles appointed and by who? They were appointed by the Lord Himself
after His ascension. (Ephesians 4:7-11)
Drake