Local Church Discussions - View Single Post - The Bible record describes God leading people into and out of things

Evangelical · 01-10-2017, 01:59 PM

InChristAlone,

We believe that Christ is the reason we meet together (Christ is the foundation) and locality is the practical way we should meet (we call this the ground). This is different to the denominations which say Christ is the reason to meet together and we should meet together because we like the same worship songs, agree on the same doctrine about method of baptism, or like the same pastor, or because "my mother and father was a Lutheran, so I am too". We meet based upon the location in which we live, not for any other reason like our worship song preferences or whether we agree on some minor doctrine or not like whether the baptismal water should be hot or cold.

Today if there are 10 Christians living in one street, they will all go to 10 different churches across the other side of the city because they like something better about each different church. In the Bible times they would have simply met together in the same street because they all lived in the same street (they met based upon locality, not any other reason). In the Bible times people met together simply because they all lived in the same city. They did not travel to a different church in another city just because there was a doctrine they disagreed with, or someone in the church they did not like or because they did not like the seats.

Today in each city there are many different churches each claiming to have Christ as their foundation. But they all look different and do things differently. If Christ is their foundation why is this? The reason is, even though Christ may be their foundation, they do not have the same ground of locality. The ground is what the foundation sits on. When we build a house, we not only make sure the foundation is solid, we also make sure the house is in a good area. We do not want to build the house next to a flood area of swamp. The foundation of our house may be perfect (Christ), but if we put that house in a swamp, people will have to walk through a swamp to get to our house. So the ground that the foundation of the house sits on is important.

We talk about the foundation versus the ground - they are different. For example, Christ may be the spiritual foundation of a group of Christians, but if they meet together only in nightclubs because they like dancing (let's call it a "dance church") then it is the nightclub which brings them together.

Today if there are a group of Christians in a city who believe in tongue-speaking, they will seek out other Christians who believe in the same - they will probably go to a pentecostal church which practices that and so they will feel comfortable. They have Christ as their foundation but tongue-speaking is their ground.

Today within one city are many churches that cater to everyone's comfort levels. We do not find that situation in the bible. We do not find any church in the bible using a name other than the place where they are. We do not find more than one church in each city. These are the biblical facts.

In the New Testament times, it was not tongue speaking or baptism or similar doctrines that brought everyone together - it was the locality. The locality is what brought the Christians together in the early church. For example, if you lived in Jerusalem you would go to the church in Jerusalem because you are in Jerusalem. You would not go to the "pentecostal church in Jerusalem" just because you believe in tongue speaking. You would not go to the 'baptist church in Jerusalem" just because you believe baptism is by immersion. The early Christians did not do that. Even we do not find a church just for Jewish Christians and one for gentile Christians in the bible - they all met together within the same city.

The ground of the Catholic church is the doctrine around St Peter as you said. The Lutheran church was grounded on the doctrines of Luther. The pentecostal churches were grounded on the doctrines of tongue speaking. The baptist churches were grounded on the doctrine of baptism by immersion. The Anglican church was grounded on the lusts of an English king and rebellion against the Pope. The Presbyterian church was built on the idea of the presbytery. We can see that today churches are grounded on things other than the place in which they exist. They are founded on Christ (spiritually) but are grounded in other things which divides them from all the other believers in their city.

01-10-2017, 01:59 PM	#40
Evangelical Member Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 3,965	Re: The lampstands in context of the message InChristAlone, We believe that Christ is the reason we meet together (Christ is the foundation) and locality is the practical way we should meet (we call this the ground). This is different to the denominations which say Christ is the reason to meet together and we should meet together because we like the same worship songs, agree on the same doctrine about method of baptism, or like the same pastor, or because "my mother and father was a Lutheran, so I am too". We meet based upon the location in which we live, not for any other reason like our worship song preferences or whether we agree on some minor doctrine or not like whether the baptismal water should be hot or cold. Today if there are 10 Christians living in one street, they will all go to 10 different churches across the other side of the city because they like something better about each different church. In the Bible times they would have simply met together in the same street because they all lived in the same street (they met based upon locality, not any other reason). In the Bible times people met together simply because they all lived in the same city. They did not travel to a different church in another city just because there was a doctrine they disagreed with, or someone in the church they did not like or because they did not like the seats. Today in each city there are many different churches each claiming to have Christ as their foundation. But they all look different and do things differently. If Christ is their foundation why is this? The reason is, even though Christ may be their foundation, they do not have the same ground of locality. The ground is what the foundation sits on. When we build a house, we not only make sure the foundation is solid, we also make sure the house is in a good area. We do not want to build the house next to a flood area of swamp. The foundation of our house may be perfect (Christ), but if we put that house in a swamp, people will have to walk through a swamp to get to our house. So the ground that the foundation of the house sits on is important. We talk about the foundation versus the ground - they are different. For example, Christ may be the spiritual foundation of a group of Christians, but if they meet together only in nightclubs because they like dancing (let's call it a "dance church") then it is the nightclub which brings them together. Today if there are a group of Christians in a city who believe in tongue-speaking, they will seek out other Christians who believe in the same - they will probably go to a pentecostal church which practices that and so they will feel comfortable. They have Christ as their foundation but tongue-speaking is their ground. Today within one city are many churches that cater to everyone's comfort levels. We do not find that situation in the bible. We do not find any church in the bible using a name other than the place where they are. We do not find more than one church in each city. These are the biblical facts. In the New Testament times, it was not tongue speaking or baptism or similar doctrines that brought everyone together - it was the locality. The locality is what brought the Christians together in the early church. For example, if you lived in Jerusalem you would go to the church in Jerusalem because you are in Jerusalem. You would not go to the "pentecostal church in Jerusalem" just because you believe in tongue speaking. You would not go to the 'baptist church in Jerusalem" just because you believe baptism is by immersion. The early Christians did not do that. Even we do not find a church just for Jewish Christians and one for gentile Christians in the bible - they all met together within the same city. The ground of the Catholic church is the doctrine around St Peter as you said. The Lutheran church was grounded on the doctrines of Luther. The pentecostal churches were grounded on the doctrines of tongue speaking. The baptist churches were grounded on the doctrine of baptism by immersion. The Anglican church was grounded on the lusts of an English king and rebellion against the Pope. The Presbyterian church was built on the idea of the presbytery. We can see that today churches are grounded on things other than the place in which they exist. They are founded on Christ (spiritually) but are grounded in other things which divides them from all the other believers in their city.