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Evangelical · 10-10-2016, 04:53 PM

Hi Nell,

you believe that "we keep the law". This is incorrect. We are no longer under law but under grace (Romans 6:14). Christ has accomplished everything for us on the cross. We cannot add or take away from that by keeping the law. If you believe that we must keep the law then you put yourself under a curse (Galatians 3:10) and Christ died in vain (Galatians 2:21). You are right that Christ taught a higher law in the New Testament. No longer just laws against murder and adultery but hatred and lust as the inward corrupting influences. However a view that we should keep these higher laws ourselves is incorrect. The higher laws are to show us that we cannot keep the laws ourselves, we must depend on grace. It doesn't matter if it is an Old Testament or a New Testament law, we depend on grace.

Regarding,

Where does the Bible say "unity of the Spirit is by the Spirit"?

I can show you.

Firstly, the fruit which is necessary to keep unity is the fruit of the Spirit, not the fruit of ourselves:Galatians 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,

You rightly mentioned that unity is by peace. Well this peace comes from the Spirit as it is a fruit of the Spirit.

Secondly, the Bible says division is caused by walking in the flesh:

1 Corinthians 3:3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?

I like the Aramaic version because it explicitly uses the phrase "walking in the flesh":

1 Corinthians 3:3 For you are still in the flesh, and wherever there is among you contention and division, behold, are you not carnal? You are walking in the flesh.

Now Paul said the solution to walking in the flesh is to walk by the Spirit:

Galatians 5:16 says "So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh."

Therefore the solution to practical disunity is to walk by the Spirit.

This is why I said "unity of the Spirit is by the Spirit".

We can also think about this from a common sense and logical viewpoint.

Unity of the Spirit must have something to do with the Spirit, because it is about "the Spirit".

I don't want to stress the obvious too much, but suppose I joined some sport club, then we would have unity because of sport. If I joined a knitting club, we would have unity because of unity. Hence, Christians have unity of the Spirit because of the Spirit.

Previously I said:

If we are in the Spirit we are actually in unity with every other believer no matter where we are.

And you said:

Romans 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. So. We if we are believers, we are in spirit. No "if's" about it. Can a believer NOT be "in the Spirit"? Not according to Paul. So obviously we believers ARE in Spirit and therefore the qualifications for unity have been met...no "locality" requirement and no "practical expression" requirement.

I agree entirely. It is actually for this reason you stated (that all believers are in the same one Spirit) that I believe there should be no disunity in the church. But I am speaking of the practical experience of living in the Spirit.

I use the term "in the Spirit" in the context of Galatians 5:25:

"If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit." (KJV).

Admittedly I could have used a different Bible version which probably more correctly says "live by the Spirit" and "walk by the Spirit", and this may have avoided your confusion.

What this means is that we cannot have practical unity unless we walk practically by (or in) the Spirit (this is something we must do and does not come automatically because we are believers).

10-10-2016, 04:53 PM	#33
Evangelical Member Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 3,965	Re: The Fallacy of Ecumenism Hi Nell, you believe that "we keep the law". This is incorrect. We are no longer under law but under grace (Romans 6:14). Christ has accomplished everything for us on the cross. We cannot add or take away from that by keeping the law. If you believe that we must keep the law then you put yourself under a curse (Galatians 3:10) and Christ died in vain (Galatians 2:21). You are right that Christ taught a higher law in the New Testament. No longer just laws against murder and adultery but hatred and lust as the inward corrupting influences. However a view that we should keep these higher laws ourselves is incorrect. The higher laws are to show us that we cannot keep the laws ourselves, we must depend on grace. It doesn't matter if it is an Old Testament or a New Testament law, we depend on grace. Regarding, Where does the Bible say "unity of the Spirit is by the Spirit"? I can show you. Firstly, the fruit which is necessary to keep unity is the fruit of the Spirit, not the fruit of ourselves:Galatians 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, You rightly mentioned that unity is by peace. Well this peace comes from the Spirit as it is a fruit of the Spirit. Secondly, the Bible says division is caused by walking in the flesh: 1 Corinthians 3:3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men? I like the Aramaic version because it explicitly uses the phrase "walking in the flesh": 1 Corinthians 3:3 For you are still in the flesh, and wherever there is among you contention and division, behold, are you not carnal? You are walking in the flesh. Now Paul said the solution to walking in the flesh is to walk by the Spirit: Galatians 5:16 says "So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh." Therefore the solution to practical disunity is to walk by the Spirit. This is why I said "unity of the Spirit is by the Spirit". We can also think about this from a common sense and logical viewpoint. Unity of the Spirit must have something to do with the Spirit, because it is about "the Spirit". I don't want to stress the obvious too much, but suppose I joined some sport club, then we would have unity because of sport. If I joined a knitting club, we would have unity because of unity. Hence, Christians have unity of the Spirit because of the Spirit. Previously I said: If we are in the Spirit we are actually in unity with every other believer no matter where we are. And you said: Romans 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. So. We if we are believers, we are in spirit. No "if's" about it. Can a believer NOT be "in the Spirit"? Not according to Paul. So obviously we believers ARE in Spirit and therefore the qualifications for unity have been met...no "locality" requirement and no "practical expression" requirement. I agree entirely. It is actually for this reason you stated (that all believers are in the same one Spirit) that I believe there should be no disunity in the church. But I am speaking of the practical experience of living in the Spirit. I use the term "in the Spirit" in the context of Galatians 5:25: "If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit." (KJV). Admittedly I could have used a different Bible version which probably more correctly says "live by the Spirit" and "walk by the Spirit", and this may have avoided your confusion. What this means is that we cannot have practical unity unless we walk practically by (or in) the Spirit (this is something we must do and does not come automatically because we are believers).