Quote:
Originally Posted by UntoHim
Ok, InOmnibusCaritas, I'm going to have to ask you to give the other new guy a little slack here. I don't know if you caught Amcasci's first number of posts, but he has been away from the Local Church for over 40 years, so exact page and paragraph quotes for are going to be a little hard for him to produce. Also you may want to appreciate the fact that Art was in the Local Church at a vastly different time and place than you. If you read my opening post, I did request that we all stay away from such caricatures and secondary issues, and I don't see where Art has intentionally stepped out of bounds in this regard.
Anyway, he is apparently on vacation so let's let him enjoy it without having to worry about playing defense until he gets back home.
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My apologies to Art.
I would like to redirect everyone back to the original question:
"Does the Local Church Teach/Preach Another Gospel and Another Jesus?"
UntoHim thinks so. He writes, "it is in the interpretation of these epistles that we see Witness Lee's departure from the historic Christian Gospel."
Believing in the Gospel is results in one being saved.
Departure from the "historic Christian Gospel" results in one in danger of being unsaved.
This question is for ALL THE MARBLES and trumps every other thread in this forum.
So far, I'm reading that:
1) "In Lees case it is the local ground, membership in the local church, and thus being an overcomer." (Amcasi)
Lee never claims that membership in LCs is precondition for being an overcomer - thus the point of his interpretation of the 7 churches in Rev. 2-3. Lee believed that Ephesus, Smyrna, and Pergamum refer to ages up to perhaps the Great Schism. The existing ones are Thyatira (Lee: Roman Catholicism), Sardis (Lee: Protestantism), Philadelphia (Lee: Recovery), and Laodicea (Lee: post-Recovery??). Although Lee believed that the Philadelphians stood the best chance of overcoming, he concedes that overcomers are called from all 7 churches. At any rate, the ground of locality is secondary when it comes to salvation.
2) "The local churches practice a different gospel than what's seen in this passage of Matthew 9:10-13. Generally viewed and termed as "good material", attention and efforts are labored on college campuses. One of the goals is to attract college students and eventually sent them as college graduates to FTTA" (Terry).
Targeting college campuses is always a good strategy for any Christian group. Again, this has nothing to do with the content of the gospel.
3) "I don't know how common some of these notions are, but I've seen enough indication that there are many in the LC who are not satisfied with simply introducing someone to the gospel." (Freedom)
I suppose that's not my LC experience but let's say this is more often than not the case. This is still not a departure from the gospel. If one doesn't use the RcV, at most they'll say you don't have an accurate Bible (though they can't pinpoint why) or that you need to read the footnotes because they provide the best interpretation of scripture. But they will not dispute whether you are saved. They will not put RcV and knowledge of the "high gospel" as a necessity for salvation. These are all post-salvation stuff.
4) "I can't speak for you, of course, but I can speak for my self and others that I know, that have left the LC, and I and them agree that we were bewitched by Lee." (Awareness)
Awareness was referring to Gal. 3:1. It is true that we have all been under Lee's spell, subscribing only to his interpretation of scripture, many of which is suspect. But Paul was talking about the gospel -- the Judaizers were telling the Galatians that, "No, faith in Jesus Christ crucified is not good enough. You also need to be circumcised in order to be part of God's covenant people". What are criteria other than the gospel did Witness Lee imposed on us in order to be God's people?
5) "Maybe from highly compromised "apologists" like Hank Hanegraaff, but I doubt you will hear anything like "we were wrong" from the likes of the 75 Christian scholars and ministry leaders from seven nations who signed the Open Letter at http://www.open-letter.org/- most of them have probably seen and heard too much about what Witness Lee actually taught to swallow the "but we are actually just misunderstood orthodox Christians" ruse."
I wonder whether the 75 Christian scholars will be so quick to denounce Lee for preaching a different gospel. They would have left LCs alone had LC/LSM not sued Harvest House and instead speak well of denominations.