Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave
We have a sanitized Bible. The Bible is the same as it has been for centuries but it is sanitized by Christian Ministers and teachers who don't want to present their parishners with some of those prominent doctrines outlined in the Bible. No one is going to heaven until the 2nd coming. Of course, one of the confusing statements is Jesus' statement: "...today you will be with me in Paradise" Luke 23:43. However, despite the fact that this robber is now in Paradise Paul and John make it clear that until the 2nd Coming no one is going to heaven. Heb 9:27-28 1, Thess 4:13-18, 1 Corinthians 15:51-52, John 6:39-40 etc Also check out Ecclesiastes 9:5, 10
|
I'm not sure about the sanitized Bible. But I agree that the version of doctrines on certain topics is somewhat "creative" (maybe that is the right word). And the older the "tradition" the fewer of these creative things there are. Seems that outside of the Corinthians who were busy having a three-ring circus of tongues, singing, etc., and arguing over what kind of body they would receive in the resurrection, most were not as concerned about it as the modern Fundamental groups seem to be. And, once again, I am a part of that (and shake my head at some of the stuff that gets talked about when they get to discussing heaven).
As for the reference to Paradise, this may have been no more than a reference to what the Jews of the time considered the holding place for the righteous follower. And whether than means that there literally is such a place where, like the rich man and Lazarus, you are conscious of others, or we are simply not aware of anything until the time of the resurrection does not seem to be problematic.
And if someone says "But Jesus said the guy would be in Paradise with him, so it must be heaven" — well not really since Jesus did not "go to heaven" until after the resurrection. Where he went on that date was wherever others went — called Paradise — not to the place where the Father dwells. But he didn't stay that long, so even if it is a real place, he is not there anymore.