Quote:
Originally Posted by OBW
I am as conservative a Christian as there is, yet I would not subscribe to this list in the manner given. First, I disagree with Lee that there is the clergy/laity problem and instead have come to see that the edict to "go ye into all the earth" was given to a few who were taken aside, not to the whole of those following at the time, so even number one is simply incorrect as an analysis of the hot – lukewarm – cold spectrum. And for the most part, the whole list stands in the same way.
Many who were diligent running out to preach the gospel will evidently be greeted with "depart from me." Activity, or the lack of it, is not the key.
But I agree that many Christians have this funny notion of what is the Spirit's leading. They even need to analyze the day to prove out for themselves that they were always within God's leading. Or alternately that God was "in control" and attribute everything to God — even the serious accident they were in in which a passenger in the other car died. They have this need to attribute everything to the sovereign hand of God.
I do not believe that we can assert that God led us unto the LRC. He may have in some cases, but that would mean that he intended for us to be the ones who experienced a cult and got out. I see no reason due to the direction of God for anyone to remain in the LRC, so I have a hard time believing that God led them in. But once they are there, I do accept that how God leads them, whether strongly enough to move them out, or just leaves them there where they are still under the leading of abusers is his choice. If everything about our life was intended to be the best it could be, we probably really would all be in the same church and it really would be wonderful. But since living in hard times during this life seems to be part of what God will use to shape us, leaving some behind in the LRC, or the RCC, or in underground churches in oppressive countries is not unexpected. Remember, in the letters to the 7 churches, there was never an edict to leave the worst among them and move to Philadelphia. You have to overcome whatever you have before you.
Besides Jesus said that things happen. Towers fall and you can't point to a reason. Rains come and sometimes they don't. People get into really good assembles and others don't (well he didn't actually say that).
We look on the outward things. God looks at the heart. My assessment of Laodicea — the place where the lukewarm reference is found — is that they were, as a group, putting on a show of piety and spirituality yet were not what they claimed. That seems to be correlated with lukewarm. Say you are when you are not. In effect, a lie. Sort of like what Yoda said. Something like "There is no try. Do, or do not." Trying, or more accurately acting as if, is lukewarm. You want to be, but not enough to actually be.
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The Book of Revelation was addressed to the 7 churches in Asia Minor and the longest distance between them is at the most about 100+ miles and as close as 20 miles so all the churches would have had access to the writings in Revelation and to each other. I am sure if someone wanted to go to Philadelphia they would probably just go there and Philadelphia was so hospitable they would have received them. It’s interesting that these churches are so extreme and different considering their proximity e.g. the church in Ephesus rejects the Nicolaitans which Jesus hates and the church in Pergamum has some who “hold to the teaching of the Nicolatians” and they are only about 100 miles apart. The church in Thyatria is into paganism eating food sacrificed to idols but only 20 miles from Thyatria and 50 miles from Philadelphia. Sardis is only 20 miles from Philadelphia but Jesus states that they have a name of being alive but are dead.
It’s an interesting interpretation of Mark 16:15 and Matt 28:19 (go ye into all the world) but I don’t have a problem with it since from my perspective it was fulfilled in Acts 2:5-13.
My list and notes regarding the list is based on Evangelical Christian’s perspectives but there are many perspectives out there to follow. What has happened and I don’t know if you are in this situation but it appears that many that are Conservative Christians are mostly “socially conservative” which translates to politically conservative. That is why my list is strictly related to the Bible without any political overtones.
How the Spirit is leading people in the LC when you consider that many leaving the LC stop by on this forum for some direction of the Spirit's leading and fellowship trying to find their way. That is what prompted me to start this thread because so many drop in and looking for the Spirit of Life for direction after either leaving the LC or still in it and do not know what to do.
You’re right about attributing everything to the sovereign hand of God. I guess it is when to determine when you do and when you don’t make this attribution. Anyway, thanks.