[aron]

Originally Posted by awareness

the seven spirits of God just seem to confound 15:45 all the more. Paul's pneumatology is confounding enough. But add Johns' seven spirits of God to the consideration and my brain becomes completely overloaded.

To me, when visualizing the throne scene (arguably the center of the universe) it becomes relatively straightforward. There is one throne, and one God on the throne. "Hear, O Israel, the LORD your God is one God..." Pretty straightforward, there. One is a simple number.

Then, "there is one name by which we can be saved". There is one name above every name, both in heaven, and on earth, and under the earth. There is one Savior, one Lord, one Shepherd; there is one Master who said, "I am the way to the Father". So you have another "one" standing in front of the throne in the scene opening John's Revelation. You have the singular "emanation" from the Father's glory. Etc, etc... there are 65 different ways to say it, but you still have "one". And we may call Him Jesus. I do, anyway.

Then, it starts to get fancy, but bear with me. You have seven spirits, seven flames burning, seven eyes of the Lamb, that run to and fro throughout the earth. There are seven angels who stand before the throne. The seven "first created spirits", according to the commentary of the ancient writers of the first and second centuries. My point is simply that John is perhaps referencing Moses building the Menorah candle stick when he stresses the seven flames in his Apocalypse.

Now, here is my point of this. When the slave girl Hagar was talking to the angel in the desert, she said, "You are the God who sees me." God sees everything, knows everything, and His will is done on earth, as it is in heaven. How? Through His Holy Spirit, who is one in essence, in function, in will, in purpose, in love, in holiness, in purity, etc etc, BUT (and here is the big but) can be manifested in Spain as well as in Puerto Rico. So in the Spirit you have the beginning (and arguably the end) of multiplicity. You have different manifestations upon the 120 in the upper room on the day of Pentecost. One might speak one tongue, another a different tongue, each praising the manifest works of God.

"Not by might, nor by strength, but by My Spirit [singular], says Jehovah God of hosts [plural].

So my vision is as simple as Lee's "processed Triune God", but with one caveat, which is that I really don't see anything at all. I'm just a doofus on the bus. I'm not the Mota, so if you don't like my vision I won't curse you as a dumb moo-cow. Anyway, my vision might be very different in 6 or 8 months, so who knows? So I'm not going to argue over "truths". The only truth is to love God and receive one another. And for me, Jesus is the way.

Originally Posted by awareness

Can't God be as many spirits as He wants to be? as well as a life-giving spirit too?

And our little brains just can't understand such numinous matters.

I'm definitely with you on the "little brains" part. God calls each star by name (Psalm 147). Every hair on your head is numbered (Luke 12). Not a bird falls from the sky but the Father doesn't know it (Matt 10).

You really don't think our brains are going to wrap that all up in a neat package, do you? And sell it to each other for 5 or 7 bucks a pop?