Quote:
Originally Posted by james73
On this, I must say, absolutely not. There is a strong sense of manipulation, yes, but claiming witchcraft is well off the mark. I know Carol's message is meant very well, but I am alarmed that my comments about my group have amplified into such strong comments, and I think several in my group would be very upset to read that.
Would you consider removing that part of the comment? I know it's a lot to ask, but it's not a pleasant accusation to make of a specific group. Certainly we can take it to a new thread and make it a general discussion, but when a specific congregation is discussed I feel it's wrong. They are good people (can't believe I just said that, rolling eyes... but they are, take away the manipulation, pride and arrogance, judgmental distrust, closed minded ignorance and sneaky behavior... ). And I'm not "brainwashed" into saying that, I can see their faults, I just don't want them dragged through THAT particular mud in a public forum, because it's a small group and it could be construed as personal. It is also faintly ridiculous and might damage any chance of a sensible discussion with the people involved - after all, I'm hanging around in order to love and help the group, not to banish them or see if they float on water.
Anyway hope that makes sense and thanks again Carol for the support 
James
PS I just read one of the google results from Carol's suggestion, where it says "witchcraft" really is just "mind control". On this, I would agree. Prayers at the LC in HK are for the group's will, not God's will. But I just wanted to make clear there was no "black magic" involved in LC in HK, because where I come from "witchcraft" means pointy hats etc. In which case I withdraw my request for Carol to edit her post, although still ask that any discussion on this proceed with caution |
Thanks for searching the meaning of witchcraft as I suggested James. I did not want to get into a heated debate. To be absolutely clear, I was not referring to the 'Harry Potter' type of witchcraft.
Because I was a person who was easily controlled and manipulated then suffered severe emotional and spiritual setbacks, I prayerfully asked the LORD to help me understand why I attracted these types of people and how to stop doing this! It was a vicious cycle with me. I finally got it! And I was set free. The Power of the Word of God and the Blood of the Lamb delivered me! But I did a lot of soul searching.
For starters, I was raised in the RCC. The Catholic church teaches they are the "one true church". That is their way of
controlling the congregants. It is the way they keep people from leaving the RCC. They put fear into people making them think something bad will happen to them if they leave. (And btw, many people who have left the RCC are returning to it).
From there, I went into the LC. Yes I became born Again through the ministry of the Word to me by the LCrs and was helped immensely to read and study the Word on topics of Sanctification and the Blood of Jesus (God Bless them!) before the adulation of WL was manifested. But the LC became no different than the RCC. It controlled people. People struggle to leave it's clutches because they fear there is 'nothing better' out there for them.
Truly they have forgotten God's promise He will NEVER leave us or forsake us and that Jesus came so we would have LIFE and have it in abundance. Not only the LIFE of Christ that will keep us from going to hell and take us to heaven, but that we would live Life to the fullest here on earth to His Glory and Praise so we can walk and live as Ambassadors of Christ bringing more people into the Kingdom.
The book of Revelation refers to the RCC as the Thyatira church.
This is the complaint the LORD has against this church:
You are permitting that woman—that Jezebel who calls herself a prophet—to lead my servants astray.
The RCC is under a principality called Jezebel who controlled her husband Ahab and put her fear into Elijah so much so he wanted to die!
Here is 1 Kings 19:1-4
When Ahab got home, he told Jezebel everything Elijah had done, including the way he had killed all the prophets of Baal. 2 So Jezebel sent this message to Elijah: “May the gods strike me and even kill me if by this time tomorrow I have not killed you just as you killed them.”
3 Elijah was afraid and fled for his life. He went to Beersheba, a town in Judah, and he left his servant there. 4 Then he went on alone into the wilderness, traveling all day. He sat down under a solitary broom tree and prayed that he might die. “I have had enough, Lord,” he said. “Take my life, for I am no better than my ancestors who have already died.”
The premise of this account is that Elijah who was filled with the Spirit of God so much so he was raptured ( 2 Kings 2:11)
As they were walking along and talking, suddenly a chariot of fire appeared, drawn by horses of fire. It drove between the two men, separating them, and Elijah was carried by a whirlwind into heaven....feared this controlling person to the point he wanted to die.
This is what religious people who claim to be doing the Lord's work do to people...they put fear into them.
Here is an exerpt from a book called:
Confronting Jezebel by
Steve Sampson
"Two things have always plagued the church:
Control and the
desire to dominate.
This power has always divided and short-circuited the power of the church.
The desire to control and dominate if
not mastered can lead to witchcraft, since witchcraft is nothing more than illegitimately controlling the will of another person.
Witchcraft which is the work of the flesh (Galatians 5:20) manifests in 3 ways:
Manipulation --- intimidation --- and domination.
The reason the desire to control is akin to witchcraft is that it is total contradiction to the Nature of God Himself.
The irrevocable gift of God gave to mankind is that of free will.
God Himself refuses to violate His Gift of free will to us. He leaves it up to us to choose HIS Way. " _
Steve Sampson -
Confronting Jezebel_
Here are some of the characteristics of the Jezebel spirit listed in Steve's book:
*
Refuses to admit guilt or wrong.
*
Takes credit for everything.
*
Ignores people ( This tactic is frequently used by leaders when someone does not agree with their plans and they isolate the person by ignoring him, choosing not even to talk to him. Some in these situations have been ignored for months simply because they chose not to be a puppet and say yes to every idea or whim. This puts the person out of the leader's grace and forces him to either "come around" to the leader's way of thinking or be indefinitely ignored. One is not free to disagree with a controller.
Steve's insert)
*
never gives credit or shows gratitude. [except to Nee and Lee-my insert]
*
criticizes everyone. (poor-poor christianity-my insert]
There are other characteristics on the list but they are not as pertinent imho to the controlling features of the LC and many church organizations.
Thanks again for doing some research James! And Thanks to all who read my post. I hope many found it useful. We are all on the same team folks...Glorifying our Creator through our Lord Jesus Christ and His Holy Spirit Who empowers us and fills us with God's Perfect Love, Truth, Joy and Peace.
Blessings, Joy and Peace to you my friend in Christ,
Carol Garza