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Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah
OK, now that clears everything up.
So, based on Paul's use of his citizenship as a Roman we as Christians have every right to use the laws that are written for all citizens.
However, we should not use the laws that allow us to sue others for libel if they are Christians, rather we should suffer loss.
However, no "Christian" would commit libel, because that means they are walking according to the flesh. Therefore it is OK to sue for libel even if the person you are suing claims to be a Christian because they are "lying".
We "know a tree by its fruit". Since their "fruit" is "evil" we can go ahead and use the laws even if they claim to be a Christian. What a wonderful loophole.
So glad you cleared that up for us.
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Precisely. According to the logic of Ray's argument any judgment requested in a civil court between believers, for whatever reason, is forbidden by Scripture. However, he argues that a Christian may sue another person, professing christian or not, if that person sins against him. Such sinning would indicate according to the argument he postulates that they are not a Christian, therefore there is a clear path to sue away. It is just to convenient.
Of course, that convenience will lead to falsely accusing genuine believers of being heathens, pagans, or false Christians. Accordingly, Duddy would only be justified writing a libelous or slanderous book against Witness Lee BECAUSE he believed Witness Lee was not a genuine Christian. In turn, LSM would only have been justified taking civil action if they believed that Duddy were not a genuine Christian. However, to the best of my knowledge, neither party accused the other of not being genuine Christians. That is where the doctrinal stance and argument taken by Ray breaks down in my view.
I personally believe there are circumstances where the civil courts play an important role in settling disputes among all its citizens. It is not the preferred route between believers but sometimes it is snecessary. It also recognizes that genuine Christians sin against God and others (including other Christians). Christians can lie, steal, move fences, covet, etc. That is just a fact. Unfortunately, sometimes a civil action is necessary.