[UntoHim]

Originally Posted by Peter Debelak

What the HELL is our faith doing enmeshed in human politics?

Originally Posted by Igzy

The only alternative is to leave politics to the unbelievers. Do we think that's what God wants? C.S. Lewis made me clear on that. If we leave art to the unbelievers, then all art will express unbelief. If we leave literature to the unbelievers, then all literature will express unbelief. If we leave TV, movies and, yes, politics to the unbelievers, then... I'm sorry, but I just don't believe that's what God wants. God made us artists, writers, thinkers and leaders. Do we think he holds that the only valid expressions of those gifts express ungodliness?? That's a flat no, as far as I'm concerned.

As an old guy, who used to be a young guy once upon a time, I can see both points of view here. Of course I’m going to side with the old guy, and not just because he happens to be right. It’s a lot easier to talk about “the only alternative” when you’ve been around the block a time or two. Mind you, it doesn’t make you an expert, just somebody who has been around the block a time or two. Old guys can be just as foolish as their younger counterparts, but the one thing they do have is the perspective of time. There is no substitute for time….unless you are God and that’s a story for another day.

There is a rather “curious” passage that comes to mind. (John 17:15,16)
“I do not ask You to take them out of the world, but to keep them from the evil one.
They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.”

Why didn’t the One with the power to do so just take us out of the world? The original apostles certainly thought that He was going to do this. Many or most of them thought the Lord Jesus was going to come back within their lifetime. He certainly left them with that impression - certainly some of their writings reflect that they had this impression. Yet this part of the Lord’s prayer to the Father in John 17 seems to indicate something different than our natural intuition.

If we are not of this world, why wouldn’t God simply let us fly up to the heavens right now and be done with it? The Bible is complete. His Word has been published far and wide. One could argue that it has reached “the uttermost parts of the earth”. What’s He waiting for? What’s the hold up? Lee and company would have us believe that it’s because “the Bride has not yet been produced”. Maybe so, maybe so. But I would argue, as Igzy might, that God has not produced enough “artists, writers, thinkers and leaders” yet. God is a Creator. Despite what some might say, He is still creating. He never stopped, and He never will. It’s mankind - it’s us that seem to be in a rut. We just need to stop resisting his creating power. Us Christians are probably the biggist hindrance to His creating power.

“Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s, and to God the things that are God’s.”
Mmmm… My question to the author of this statement might be: aren’t the things of Ceasar also the things of God? I think His answer might very well be “My point exactly”.