[Ohio]

Originally Posted by aron

If someone says, "I believe", what exactly do they believe, here? The only conclusion I can come up with is, "I believe everything the MOTA says", and "I believe that I'll keep my mouth shut so as not to get in trouble", or "I believe that I'll just 'amen' today's message" and so forth. That becomes your faith, not Jesus Christ. Naivete becomes deliberate and determined obtuseness. And how many pseudo-Christian cults build on this very same foundation?

In modern LC vernacular, this is an apt description for what is commonly referred to as “The Vision.”

Back to RK on the beginning of the thread: for WN and WL, he uses criteria for their person, their constitution, their ministry, and their vision. Would the NT apostles have cut their family into church tithes, creating for-profit entities with family members at the helm, creating clear conflict-of-interest issues? Would NT apostles have put admittedly "unspiritual" progeny as business managers, and then have overlooked their repeated abuses of church members? Would NT apostles have leveraged their church position to get "investments" from church members, then tell them on the phone, as WL did to SB, that the current disposition of the funds was "my personal business"? And the same thing with WN with his machinations and business dealings and church-fund shuffling - what kind of impression should we get of their constitution and their person, after looking at the history?

Apostle Paul would tell us boldly, “We are NOT like these guys, peddling the Word of God for their own personal profit.” - 2 Cor 2.17