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Forum: David Canfield 07-14-2012, 09:29 PM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

Yes, I think the principle is we follow Christ first. If you think your leader is in error then you need to be free to follow your convictions.

But any other question about the situation--whether...
Forum: David Canfield 07-14-2012, 08:38 PM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

Well, the second is not making an assumption at all.

But my point is we can't function without making some assumptions. Let's say for example you are sharing the lead in a Bible study and its...
Forum: David Canfield 07-13-2012, 08:08 PM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

Maybe I'm not really understanding what problem you are describing.

I didn't mean walking from A to B. I meant, for example, dealing with people. Dealing with Christians. Dealing with life. And...
Forum: David Canfield 07-13-2012, 07:23 PM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

I didn't say we should fill in the blanks. What I implied was that we are going to fill in some blanks no matter what, else we are not going to have any kind of practical church or living at all.
...
Forum: David Canfield 07-13-2012, 06:09 PM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

In the first place, we have to make some assumptions about what church is, since the Bible doesn't tell us everything. So of course I've made some. I could not do otherwise.

Second, the balance...
Forum: David Canfield 07-13-2012, 05:21 PM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

Well, that's a whole 'nother kettle of fish. Because if you are taking on the idea of official administration of a practical church then you are taking on 99.99% of churches in the world. Good luck...
Forum: David Canfield 07-13-2012, 10:40 AM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

Let me also say this. I sympathize with LCers who say, "I have the vision of one church in a city. What can I do? I must stand on that."

I would say then do so. There is nothing wrong with...
Forum: David Canfield 07-13-2012, 10:16 AM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

Again this shows that the LC vision is not really about the Ground of Locality, it's about following the right administration.

The Ground of Locality is just a means by which the LC discredits...
Forum: David Canfield 07-13-2012, 09:39 AM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

Yep. Who decides? The apostle? Who decides who the apostle is?

Which ties into Peter's question.



Good to see you, Peter. I'm glad you asked, because I need to clarify what I mean by the...
Forum: David Canfield 07-13-2012, 08:55 AM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

Credentials don't prove competence, but they certainly put the odds in its favor.

If you were hiring a delivery company, would you be more likely to hire them if none of the drivers had driver's...
Forum: David Canfield 07-12-2012, 09:42 AM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

This is why I continue to make the point that the LC model is not really about having one "church" per city. It's about having one organized entity with one administration per city.

"Church" can...
Forum: David Canfield 07-12-2012, 08:05 AM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

To say that 2 or 3 can't be a church because Jesus used this example in Matthew 18 is an example of bending the scripture to produce a predetermined result.

Jesus likely isn't saying that just 2...
Forum: David Canfield 07-12-2012, 07:29 AM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

Me too. It sounded so good. Remember the catch-phrase "the proper church life?' When WL would say he would hold the 'o' in proper for a moment. "The proooper church life." I must have heard that...
Forum: David Canfield 07-11-2012, 07:43 PM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

Yeah, usually you end up with what would be a great philosophy... except for the big, fat, stinking elephant in the living room.


Nee... with no provision for identifying local leadership, or...
Forum: David Canfield 07-11-2012, 09:57 AM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

If you study the originators of influential, but harebrained, ideas, like Marx (communism), Keynes (Keynesian economics), or Ayn Rand (egoism), you see a common theme. Often they retrofit a...
Forum: David Canfield 07-11-2012, 08:29 AM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

Brother Canfield doesn't see that the Ground of Locality doctrine enabled, justified and entrenched this corrupt behavior, which is why he is still trying to defend the doctrine.

Perhaps he...
Forum: David Canfield 07-11-2012, 07:39 AM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

I made a major error in my previous post. I wrote:

But a common-sense reading of this suggests intuitively that the church in P&A's house is a subset or partial overlap of the people he is...
Forum: David Canfield 07-10-2012, 04:42 PM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

I want to take on one more thing today, because this is the opus of Canfield's case for the Ground of Locality.

If we wish to deny the ground of oneness in locality, we must ask ourselves, what...
Forum: David Canfield 07-10-2012, 12:05 PM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

I think it's important to regularly re-examine our beliefs and assumptions in the light of the Bible, and to pray about the matters we take for granted.

One thing we all long for is assurance...
Forum: David Canfield 07-10-2012, 09:52 AM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

Thanks, aron. I appreciate your trojan horse metaphor.

I would add also than another factor in believing in the LC one-church-city-administation (OCCA?) model is the deeply-felt need to know one...
Forum: David Canfield 07-09-2012, 11:05 PM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

David Canfield's book on the Ground of Locality (http://www.standforthetestimony.org/book-ground/) is pretty much standard issue LC doctrine. Canfield for the most part uses the same examples, the...
Forum: David Canfield 07-09-2012, 07:21 PM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Re: Canfield on the Ground of Locality

UntoHim, I think I'll just post some of the main points from that article. It's a little long and not that well-organized. Often I write just to get my thoughts together and sometimes that results in...
Forum: David Canfield 07-09-2012, 09:01 AM
Replies: 61
Views: 35,928
Posted By Cal
Canfield on the Ground of Locality

I spent several hours writing a 3200 word rebuttal to Canfield's booklet "Regarding the Ground of Oneness in Locality." But I decided not to make it public because I don't want to discourage brother...
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