Originally Posted by Cal

E129 - Put Fear in its Place

If you fear God, you don't have to fear anything else.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QzrIKl8ZFE

Originally Posted by TLFisher

As I said in the comment section of the video, "Well spoken. Comparison to the Penn State scandal is valid. Regarding Max and John, the co-workers had opportunity to reconcile and let the opportunity slip away."
In one of the last opportunities the brothers had to reconcile, instead of receiving John they had John escorted off the premises.
Additionally I would say the authors at Shepherdingwords.com cannot say anything in completion regarding Max and John without mentioning Phillip.
It is a partial truth for Shepherdingwords.com to say John left. To omit the rest of the story is to make the partial pass as the whole. Much like Ananias and Sapphira did in Acts chapter 5, Shepherdingwords.com has done the same.
Regarding Max, though I was living in Anaheim at the time I have no recollection of him as I did Francis Ball, Al Knoch, and John Ingalls. I was but a 4th grader at the time Max left.
I will say per testimony of a family friend who went with my parents to Francis Ball's memorial service, Max was there. Blended co-workers had opportunity to speak with Max, but instead treated him as if there was some magnetic polarity field preventing them from approaching Max. I can see that happening. I witnessed something similar in Bellevue, WA at my uncle's memorial service in 2014. Steve Isitt was there. None of the metro Seattle (Bellevue/Seattle/Renton) elders who were present could approach Steve either. There was a magnetic field preventing the brothers from approaching Steve. I say that in sarcasm, but it demonstrates the brothers unwillingness to be cordial at best.

Originally Posted by TLFisher

The message is simple. If the Lords Recovery does not want to be called a cult, stop acting like one.

Originally Posted by Cal

E128 - Why Can't the Lord's Recovery Figure Out Why it is Called a Cult?

It's not rocket science.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHR9fidHbB4

Originally Posted by UntoHim

Originally Posted by PriestlyScribe

Hey Cal, in case you didn't know it - YouTube offers a feature that can be handy for subscribers and it's called "End Screens". I believe you should consider going back & adding this feature to all of your videos even though it would entail considerable work. How it functions is during the final seconds of your video's playback a prompt will display on the player screen which is clickable and can immediately take your viewer to that link. The way I have used this can be seen with my mirrored upload of your Episode 1 at the BlendedBrothers YT channel (since torpedoed by LSM). Here is a photo showing how that appeared for viewers as the video was wrapping up (the last 45 seconds):

Hope this tip helps your work get even more exposure. Keep cranking out the truth. So many former LC member's lives depend upon channels like yours. It has sure helped me a lot!

P.S.

Originally Posted by Cal

E93 - shepherdingwords.com - Yet More Recovery Gaslighting

Examining the April 2021 posts on shepherdingwords.com, where the LR gaslights about history and "the tree of life."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-ijiWp8ddw

Originally Posted by Cal

E27 - Witness Lee's Pasadena Rant

Looking back at Witness Lee's bizarre rant in Pasadena in 1988, where he uplifted himself up in a most inappropriate way.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4cXvByMqVrQ

Originally Posted by PriestlyScribe

I would like to believe that this second subroutine was at work in Sherman Robertson and Joel Kennon when they threw Steve Isitt out of the meeting hall for writing this Amazon best seller...


What is the opposite of a tractor beam?
Fellowship Barrier!

P.S.

Originally Posted by Terry

I witnessed something similar in Bellevue, WA at my uncle's memorial service in 2014. Steve Isitt was there. None of the metro Seattle (Bellevue/Seattle/Renton) elders who were present could approach Steve either. There was a magnetic field preventing the brothers from approaching Steve. I say that in sarcasm, but it demonstrates the brothers unwillingness to be cordial at best.

Originally Posted by Cal

E55 - Max, John and Other Abuses

Examining the half-truths and lies presented by "the Lord's Recovery" about how it handled Max Rapoport, John Ingalls and other abuses.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FAR5WQ3cJMs

Originally Posted by Cal

E63 - Truly a Legacy of Shame - "The Lord's Recovery" Movement of Witness Lee

Quotations from leaders of aberrant groups down through history show that "the Lord's Recovery's" claims of being the unique move of God are nothing new.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FdF-zGteMgo

Originally Posted by Cal

E118 -
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZOSZgNy7aU

Originally Posted by Terry

The ShepherdingWords article would have been more appropriate to suggest the sons of Eli should have received covering. After all how many decades has certain LSM co-workers been running interference by covering Timothy Lee and Phillip Lee?

Originally Posted by FaithHopeLove

Wow, I'm just listening to your videos now. It's really just wow. I'm listening from Episode 1 now. I had no idea it was this bad. And I thought it was already really bad. You see, I did not know anyone who left this place because they've finally understood the truth. I felt so trapped and it was as if just me who is "gasping for air". You are already addressing many of the things that are disturbing. I am so sure there are many people out there who are like me. They have no idea about any of this and they do not know of anyone who has stepped out of this place. Yet, I believe the Holy Spirit is nudging them to see the truth. I had many moments like that too but I did not realize it at the time. May God be merciful.

Originally Posted by Cal

E51 - Covering Up, Not Covering

First part of examining "the Lord's Recovery's" misinterpretation and misuse of the biblical story of Noah's curse of Ham and Canaan.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N55gxAg0IlU

Originally Posted by Cal

I think we "mush" about it because we want to know what it was really about. If I hadn't done so I wouldn't have learned so much and been able to make those videos. And I wouldn't have met great folks like you, zeek and the rest.

Originally Posted by awareness

I too went thru the material. I knew of some, but most not. And much happened after I left.

All of the material confirmed what I knew in my spirit when I walked. I can't believe how much I'm still mushing over all this.. Wouldn't it be best just to walk completely away from the mess. Paul Ma did not do this. I knew him personally. He was a sweet brother, but was covering up much that he knew was going on behind the scenes.

Harold

Originally Posted by zeek

Thanks for posting this episode. It reminded me of how much the leadership kept lowly members like myself in the dark. I pulled up the transcript for close reading http://localchurch.web.fc2.com/PDF/A...coveryinUS.pdf

Originally Posted by Cal

This new version of Episode 33 was created using natural-voice AI-generated text-to-speech software. It is much more listenable than the original, and I hope this makes it more accessible to those seeking to learn more about the Lord's Recovery movement.

E115 - A Spoken History of the Lord's Recovery (1960-1997) - Natural-sounding Voice Version

A spoken version of Steve Isitt's "A History of the Lord's Recovery in the US." This history reveals little known surreptitious events in the movement from 1960 to 1997. Witness Lee is the central character in this sordid history of an abusive Christian sect.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJqxpt_K7DM

Originally Posted by Cal

E113 - MOTA!

All my MOTA! cartoons in one place. Thanks again for listening!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GJEgSk9IlI

Originally Posted by manna-man

Sounds more life like!

Hi CAL!

Originally Posted by Cal

This new version of Episode 33 was created using natural-voice AI-generated text-to-speech software. It is much more listenable than the original, and I hope this makes it more accessible to those seeking to learn more about the Lord's Recovery movement.

E115 - A Spoken History of the Lord's Recovery (1960-1997) - Natural-sounding Voice Version

A spoken version of Steve Isitt's "A History of the Lord's Recovery in the US." This history reveals little known surreptitious events in the movement from 1960 to 1997. Witness Lee is the central character in this sordid history of an abusive Christian sect.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJqxpt_K7DM

Originally Posted by Trapped

Cal, just wanted to say that there are lots messages being sent in one-on-one communication among former members when your videos come out. Things like "Cal just put out a new video!", "We watched Cal's new episode last night; you will find such-and-such part very helpful!" and "He really nailed it so clearly about the control!" etc, etc.

Just wanted to pass that along so you know many people continue to be so helped by your channel, even if the comments and gratitude occur behind the scenes rather than where you actually see them on this forum or on the channel itself.

Grateful for your continued examination of the Lord's Recovery!

Trapped

Originally Posted by Cal

E105 - The Return of the Controllers

Discussing how ultimately "the Lord's Recovery" is a mechanism of control.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2R7A5_cAmUQ

Originally Posted by Ohio

Yes, indeed, Cal's YouTube channel covering numerous LC topics has been quite helpful to all former members.

I have always said that only former members truly understand the spiritual dynamics that we face, and Cal has great wisdom and insight to express these LC errors in plain words.

Originally Posted by Bible-believer

I came across this channel the other day. A brother, who was a member of LR, talks about Witness Lee.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...j1LkAvz05f-LuU

Originally Posted by HERn

This is sad. Are you saying some of our gay brothers and sisters in the LC have killed themselves?

Originally Posted by Indiana

I think you are right on the mark in your probe into the mindset of those responsible for the handling of the fateful case of Greg and Jo Casteel since June 9, 2019.

Originally Posted by awareness

I'm in touch with gay ex church kids, and they relate the trauma they went thru while in the LC, with strong tendency to suicide, due to LC rejection, and LC family rejection. Because of that they loose the friendships they made while growing up in the LC, leaving them destitute.

It's sad to grow up gay in the LC. It's not a choice. And rejection drives them to suicide.

Is the local church bemoaning that? Of course not. There's 6 verses out of 35,000 against it, and the LC is holding to those 6 verses.

So their concern about suicide rings hollow to me. To me they've gone Bible crazy.

Originally Posted by HERn

This is sad. Are you saying some of our gay brothers and sisters in the LC have killed themselves?

Originally Posted by awareness

The recovery can speak against suicide until the cows come home, but won't own up to driving gays that grow up in the LC to suicide.

Originally Posted by Cal

E99 - The "Lord's Recovery" Discusses Suicide

Commenting on a "Lord's Recovery" shepherdingwords.com article that discusses suicide, and how it comes up short.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j50XtLRGQaQ

Originally Posted by Cal

E99 - The "Lord's Recovery" Discusses Suicide

Commenting on a "Lord's Recovery" shepherdingwords.com article that discusses suicide, and how it comes up short.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j50XtLRGQaQ

Originally Posted by Cal

Let me know if you have a topic you would like me to discuss. Thanks!

Originally Posted by Cal

E95- God Doesn't Want Everyone to be the Same

Examining how God made a wide variety of people, as reflected in the Myers-Briggs personality types, and how the "Lord's Recovery's" way of trying to make everyone the same is contrary to this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWCrNhjIqQ0

Originally Posted by Covert

I just talked about you my brother (in another thread), good to see you post again. We were discussing witness lee goonery by LR members in another thread. I will check out that video later, for the mean time, have a blessed day.

Originally Posted by Cal

E93 - shepherdingwords.com - Yet More Recovery Gaslighting

Examining the April 2021 posts on shepherdingwords.com, where the LR gaslights about history and "the tree of life."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-ijiWp8ddw

Originally Posted by Ohio

Cal, you have done well.

You have used your talents to help others, those who are hurting.

Originally Posted by Cal

E88 - A Final Word, For Now

Wrapping up this video series... for now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFf9RCo-G5Q

Originally Posted by Terry

If it is the same one I was part of in 2018, there should be a disclaimer. "If you are a conservative, you do so at your own peril."

Originally Posted by Cal

But you can join the Facebook "Former Members of the Local Church" group to see them. It is another group of former members in discussion.

Originally Posted by Curious

I am buying! only its free so I don't pay money!!

One thing I've thought about for a long time but not said....when you list famous actors who grew up in cults, on one of your episodes, they happen to be all women. One significant man actor is Joaquim Phoenix. He and his brother River both grew up in the one with the 'flirty fishing', which practised paedophilia. His brother River, died young and he has survived, and drawn on his experience in the cult, no doubt, to make an excellent depraved, incestuously motivated Emporer in the movie 'the Gladiator.'...a movie that also accurately portrays the pre-Christian world of Rome. And the pall of despair and darkness that pervaded life there.

I just think it might be an encouragement to male readers to have an example of a male in that mix too. Otherwise, keep going. I will subscribe to both of your channels!

Originally Posted by Curious

Ahhh, I see, I finally get it. When the LC quarantines a person, they are actually quarantining, or shunning, THEMSELVES from that person. Not the obvious way around!

Originally Posted by Curious

Ahhh, I see, I finally get it. When the LC quarantines a person, they are actually quarantining, or shunning, THEMSELVES from that person. Not the obvious way around.

Originally Posted by Curious

Ahhh, I see, I finally get it. When the LC quarantines a person, they are actually quarantining, or shunning, THEMSELVES from that person. Not the obvious way around.

Originally Posted by Cal

E83 - Highlights of Interview with Cult Expert Steve Hassan - The "Lord's Recovery" of Witness Lee

Jordan Harbinger interviews cult expert Steve Hassan about controlling group practices.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wn1l8Dvp3nA

Originally Posted by Cal

E85 - Am I Being Judgmental? - The "Lord's Recovery" of Witness Lee

Addressing a judgmental listener's claims that I should not be judgmental.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkV1Grm7SxI

Originally Posted by Cal

The "Recovery" is all the good stuff, which they claim as theirs. All the bad stuff is not theirs. It doesn't matter what is is--if they like it they claim it as part of their legacy. If not, it's someone else's. And it doesn't matter how historically mixed-up and in various combinations these good and bad things have occurred. If it was good it's the "Recovery," and if it was bad it's "Christianity."

They never own failure. Why? Because "the Recovery" is by definition only the good stuff. If it's bad it's categorically not "the Recovery," therefore it's not them.

It's an astounding and monstrous self-deception. But it's equally astounding how effective it can be. People seem to want so much to believe that they are the good guys, and someone else are the bad guys.

Originally Posted by Cal

What they do is identify what they consider the best parts of Christian and Church history and say that's OUR legacy and even that's US. And they identify the bad parts and say that's "CHRISTIANITY'S" legacy and that's THEM.

The "Recovery" is all the good stuff, which they claim as theirs. All the bad stuff is not theirs. It doesn't matter what is is--if they like it they claim it as part of their legacy. If not, it's someone else's. And it doesn't matter how historically mixed-up and in various combinations these good and bad things have occurred. If it was good it's the "Recovery," and if it was bad it's "Christianity."

They never own failure. Why? Because "the Recovery" is by definition only the good stuff. If it's bad it's categorically not "the Recovery," therefore it's not them.

It's an astounding and monstrous self-deception. But it's equally astounding how effective it can be. People seem to want so much to believe that they are the good guys, and someone else are the bad guys.

Originally Posted by aron

The LR says "we are the genuine [local] expression of God" yet they still teach that all the seven churches in Revelation 2 and 3 were genuine local churches of God, represented by real golden lampstands, which lampstands typify various groups (Protestant, Bretheren, RCC etc). But they say those groups are not genuine local churches. So they are genuine lampstands, and then they are not. This is fairly illogical, as well.

I mean, let your yes be yes, and your no be no. Instead you get this illogical, "It is (but it isn't)". You'll note that they sing the classic Protestant hymns, calling them "our rich heritage", then blast all Protestants for being Babyolon. And so forth. And no members notice the hypocrisy?

Originally Posted by googlelight

even if LR is philadelfia or laodecia (not up to me to judge), the Lord is still speaking to to the rest of the churches, calling them to overcome. So it is fairly illogical to me to have a view that the speaking is only among LR, yet many there still hold this view. I dont understand this at all.

Originally Posted by googlelight

thank you, I have watched episode 83 around 7 or 8 times. Should be useful for all christian on this planet imo! As I was considering all of this, it just dawned on me; 1 Cor 12:21 says; "The eye cannot say to the hand, “I don’t need you!” LR seems to claim they are the eye. "Vision of the age" "High Peaks of divine revelation." The hand, to me, seems to be those today that labor preaching the gospel. at the very best, this is true, and even if it was, the eye cant say "I dont need you to the hand." This seems to me to be exactly what is happening. And I am still considering this, even if LR is philadelfia or laodecia (not up to me to judge), the Lord is still speaking to to the rest of the churches, calling them to overcome. So it is fairly illogical to me to have a view that the speaking is only among LR, yet many there still hold this view. I dont understand this at all. Thank you so much for all these videos to me, it has helped me more than I can describe Cal!

Originally Posted by Cal

E84 - Killing the Nattering Nabobs of Negativity - aka the Prophets

Showing how the "Lord's Recovery" ignores God's offce of prophets and even, like all corrupt religious leaders, kills the prophets.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIPIKwCF6E0

Originally Posted by Terry

Me too! The first thought I had was FTTA. I never attended, but I heard stories of insufficient sleep. I'm in the opinion insufficient sleep can lead to physical health/mental health issues.
Brothers I had lived in a brother's house with, prior to FTTA they were real characters. Hilarious, compassionate, and simply full of life. As FTTA graduates I barely recognized them as people. Their personality was replaced by the ministry.

Originally Posted by Trapped

When Steve was talking about sleep deprivation affecting critical thinking skills, I thought of the FTTA.

Originally Posted by Cal

E83 - Highlights of Interview with Cult Expert Steve Hassan - The "Lord's Recovery" of Witness Lee

Jordan Harbinger interviews cult expert Steve Hassan about controlling group practices.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wn1l8Dvp3nA

Originally Posted by Trapped

Several episodes back there was a "DCP Part 1" type thing in the title of the video. Are you planning on doing a DCP Part 2?

Originally Posted by Cal

E81 - Megalomaniacs - The "Lord's Recovery" Movement of Witness Lee

More exposure of the corrupted mentality of "the Lords' Recovery."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LYC8IQGgzMw

Originally Posted by Curious

Thankyou for that. Interesting you validate my sarcasm, I am embracing it, I see it has it's place.

I can't help but wonder if the 10 commandments were rewritten to reflect WL's theology, what would that read like?

Originally Posted by Curious

I can't help but wonder if the 10 commandments were rewritten to reflect WL's theology, what would that read like?

Originally Posted by Ohio

Great points, Curious. I just love how a little sarcasm can be used to expose some of the worst nonsense surrounding WL's own opinions.

Originally Posted by Curious

Yes, opinion is certainly the work of the devil in us. Adam and Eve had no opinions or nasty soulish 'feelings' before the fall. We know this because it must be so, so that Witness Lee is proved correct.

Originally Posted by Trapped

Speaking up after you leave? DCP goes after you.

And then they circle tighter and shun the struggling member so their echo chamber reinforces itself all the more.

It's sad because the effect is on human lives. But since they circled tighter they don't see the effect. And even when they do see the effect, they, uncomprehendingly, don't care.

Originally Posted by Freedom

This is a great video. So many of the problems within the LC are related to things like their authority structure or lack of humility. It's hard to believe how they can remain so oblivious to some of these readily apparent problems like their public perception, members leaving, etc.

Before I left, it seemed like there was was an ever-increasing disregard for current members who were struggling or who might be considering leaving. Even just in general, the LC didn't give any thought to making the environment the type of place that people would want to be part of.

Originally Posted by Curious

Episode 74, I just want to say, excellent!

Originally Posted by googlelight123

Thank you for this profound video.
I got EF. 4:16 while listening.
The Body.. Builds up itself in... love
Not through the ministry of the age, or Gods economy... In love. Thank you. This is true light...it has set me free

Originally Posted by Cal

E70 - The Appalling "Apostle" Effect - "The Lord's Recovery" Movement of Witness Lee

More examination into the bad fruit produced by claiming apostleship.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QlW8_coUuG0

Originally Posted by Cal

E70 - The Appalling "Apostle" Effect - "The Lord's Recovery" Movement of Witness Lee

More examination into the bad fruit produced by claiming apostleship.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QlW8_coUuG0

Originally Posted by byHismercy

Hey Cal, I realized later you covered everything I mentioned in my comment. (I listened to this installment with giggling 6 and 11 year olds literally crawling all over me.) Next time I will slow down and listen to the whole thing before I start ranting.

Originally Posted by Cal

E69 - No, Witness Lee wasn't an Apostle - "The Lord's Recovery" Movement of Witness Lee

Responding to the shepherdingwords.com article on apostles and co-workers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pyng2LDKbI

Originally Posted by Cal

E68 - Partial Inspiration, Temporal Discipline and Endless Self-Promotion

Seemingly everything "the Lord's Recovery" teaches is an opportunity for them to promote themselves.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=blt3RPv5h6g

Originally Posted by Trapped

Cal, this was a great example of the Lord's recovery's hypocritical positions taken to their logical end.

Honestly I'm surprised the blended brothers haven't contacted you directly yet to join their ranks - you represented their teachings perfectly!

Originally Posted by byHismercy

Very encouraging, brother! The Lord was amening your message within!

Originally Posted by Curious

An old-fashioned saying that I think sums up the relationship between loving others, trust, and one's having ownership of one's own choices and responsibilities in life goes like this:

'Love many, trust few, always paddle your own canoe!'

I say that over in my mind whenever something pops up around me that could compromise one of those 3 values. I think it harmonises well with episode 64.

Originally Posted by Cal

E64 - What to Do? Where to Go? What to Be? - "The Lord's Recovery" Movement of Witness Lee

Thoughts on some questions I've received and on going forward from wherever you find yourself.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxlI7in83IM

Originally Posted by jesusislord

this is a masterpiece. But Cal you should share positive experience after you left and join other groups. I think for that you can have another 50+ videos, your channel is helpful for those who had left and still a believer of Jesus.

Originally Posted by Cal

E63 - Truly a Legacy of Shame - "The Lord's Recovery" Movement of Witness Lee

Quotations from leaders of aberrant groups down through history show that "the Lord's Recovery's" claims of being the unique move of God are nothing new.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FdF-zGteMgo

Originally Posted by Trapped

Thanks for all the time and work you've put into these 62 episodes, Cal.

Originally Posted by jesusislord

Hi Cal, maybe you want to speak about the fruits of exclusivity?

Originally Posted by Indiana

http://www.ourneedtoexamineourselves...ateMeeting.pdf

John Ingalls explains his experience in the required annual business meeting referred to in Shepherding Words. Brother Lee had strategically moved Minoru Chen into position as an elder in Anaheim.


Excerpt

"The business meeting and election were to take place on the Lord’s Day, March 5th. On Thursday evening, March 2nd, Al and I met with Minoru Chen and Philip Lim to discuss the agenda for the business meeting. Minoru made a point very strongly that according to our custom the directors should always be elders. In fact, without our knowledge, in the preceding Lord’s Day meeting on the Chinese-speaking side, Minoru had educated the saints to this effect, pointing out that in the coming election for directors, they should do the same on the English-speaking side. This we declined to do in the present divided situation, since the by-laws expressly stated that any member of the corporation could be nominated and elected to the post. We anticipated that this time we would have to vote by ballot as there would likely be more than one candidate nominated.

Originally Posted by Cal

E55 - Max, John and Other Abuses

Examining the half-truths and lies presented by "the Lord's Recovery" about how it handled Max Rapoport, John Ingalls and other abuses.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FAR5WQ3cJMs

Originally Posted by Cal

Curious, I think there is some of what you say going on. And the denial and duplicity which accompanies it, particularly the accusing others of slander, who are simply reporting what the LR has at least internally proclaimed and taught, is unacceptable.

If they are trying to improve their beliefs and message that is good, but to go about it by denying they have held to bad beliefs in the past, and further to accuse others of slander who testify to that, is not encouraging at all.

They are either clueless or liars.

Originally Posted by Ohio

If the Recovery teaching about "covering" were an actual truth of the Bible, then shouldn't King David have cursed the prophet Nathan for not "covering" him? (II Samuel 12)

David was, after all, the greatest anointed king of Israel. If ever there was needed this "covering" teaching it was for him.

Originally Posted by Curious

Hi, I have just got to add my 2 cents worth here.

By ‘cursing’ dissenters the LRM are acting in spiritual blindness and are validating the flesh as described by Cal. Noah didn’t know better, he wasn’t provided a new testament copy of the bible!!. But we don't have that excuse anymore, and neither does the LRM.

Originally Posted by Curious

By ‘cursing’ dissenters the LRM are acting in spiritual blindness and are validating the flesh as described by Cal. Noah didn’t know better, he wasn’t provided a new testament copy of the bible!!. But we don't have that excuse anymore, and neither does the LRM.

Originally Posted by aron

We're still waiting for the culture of silence to be broken.

MC: "And now we'll address any questions or issues you may have."

Sister X: ""I'm wondering when I can have my book published by LSM, to take its place besides the one by Mary McDonough. Why is LSM selling her book online, and not mine?"
MC: "I'm sorry, my dear sisters, but the door for revelation to sisters is now closed. Once Brother Nee put quill to parchment, that age ended, and a new age began. But don't worry, there's a place for you today, in the children's meetings."

Sister Y: "Brother Minoru, we can see in ministry literature that sisters once held responsible positions next to Lee and Nee. In writing on the resumption of Watchman Nee's ministry, for example, WL said that only two sisters sat up front with him as Nee talked, while the rest of the congregation was seated apart. So what happened to the role of women in the church?"
MC: "Again, my dear sisters, you have to understand that the age changed. Today, your responsibility is to be docile and listen to my patronizing lectures."

Sister Z: "Did anyone ever tell you that you're full of baloney?"

The counsel of many will be restored, as is stated in Proverbs. In many counselors, battles are one, and safety is secured. May the Lord grant all of us courage to seek this, and to speak out our counsel, and not give up. Minoru's a Christian confessor, yet at present he seems willing to live with such glaring contradictions (among many), and then becomes a tool of oppression and control.

In the church, it's the age of Jesus Christ, not the age of spiritual giants nor the age of small potatoes. Each one has a voice in the common counsel, and none should be denied. There's no male or female, young or old, slave or free man, Jew or Greek. rich or poor. If LSM Blendeds won't step up and lead believers into this, someone else will. A new day has dawned, the saints are going on.

Originally Posted by byHismercy

https://youtu.be/SdXXUIvhP30

Hi Cal, just wanted to share this perspective from ones discussing the last few minutes of Minorus message to the sisters. I think you said you didn't listen to the whole thing? I didn't either, but this member (members?) found some cause for concern.

It just seems like the culture of silence Minoru is promoting amongst the sisters speaks in defiance of Gods' word....in the council of many is safety.....

Originally Posted by byHismercy

It just seems like the culture of silence Minoru is promoting amongst the sisters speaks in defiance of Gods' word....in the council of many is safety.....

Originally Posted by Cal

E45 - Looking at Minoru Chen's Messages to Sisters

Some commentary on messages regarding the role of women in "the Lord's Recovery."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpxRTNlTCHE

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Originally Posted by Unregistered

For the pity of the 'sisters', calling for comments on Minoru Chen's messages to the LSM LC LR 'sisters'. 2019 messages. And 18 lessons for sisters!

Search : 2019 NorCal Sisters Conference

Originally Posted by Ohio

Think about the lust for power which then inevitably develops in fallen leaders. Who would not want to be above the law concerning all their failures. I have long been convinced that the constant rivalry between Anaheim and Cleveland was due to such perks for the winner. Could not Lee's successor, the subsequent MOTA, now eliminate his rival by fabricated charges resulting in quarantine.

Does not these MOTA teachings, by definition, result in ecclesiastical politics? Is this not ruling like the Gentiles? Did not our Lord specifically warn us about this?

Originally Posted by Cal

The LR in general discourages close relationships with anyone not in your immediate family. (I've even heard them teach "don't love your wife too much.") They discourage friendships, both with people inside and outside the LR. Witness Lee often spoke about not being "buddy-buddy" with anyone. These types of relationships were considered "soulish."

The LR also has a strange view of our relationship with God, they talk more about "experiencing" Christ (in a rather impersonal way) than getting to know Him as a person.

And the LR has an extreme view of our relationships with ourselves. They believe in "denying" the self to the point of low self esteem.

All these approaches work together for the LR to isolate you emotionally and take control of your emotional life in order to become the controlling emotional factor in your life. According to them, your sole source of enjoyment should be your experience of God, which of course they define. This furthers their control.

All these teaching are unhealthy.

Originally Posted by googlelight

Dear brother, it is so lovely you put this out.

"There are some people who say we cannot tell...
Well, I was there when it happened and so I guess I ought to know"

Originally Posted by Cal

E39 - A Broader Perspective, Part 3

More examination of "the Lord's Recovery" as a undo-influencing, controlling group, looking at how it lines up with Steve Hassan's "Influence Continuum." The results do not reflect well on the LR.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wr2P7ZS6ZLk

Originally Posted by Indiana

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHjUTJuYBco

Here is the message by Ron Kangas revealing what he thinks of the conscience.

Dec 2018 at the 1:12:18 mark for context - 1:16.04 of the sound byte

Originally Posted by Indiana

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHjUTJuYBco

Here is the message by Ron Kangas revealing what he thinks of the conscience.

Originally Posted by Curious

As an outsider, its pretty obvious:
'God's economy' implies He's a businessman. A business man is trading, selling a product (the ministry), the agenda is to promote the success of His business. Persons are merely commodities in this grand business. In every business, a commodity is only of value in so far as it's earning its way to expand your business, and drawing in the customers. Otherwise it's expendable. A 'product' has no intrinsic value in itself beyond this.

When you think in terms of 'Gods economy', the language of WL gives it all away. everything Cal is saying.

I never heard the concept of God as 'Father' mentioned at any time by LCers I knew and fellowshipped with. This was an early question mark for me. The sense of the sanctity of human life is therefore not indicated, a clear aspect of Christianity that sets it apart from other religions of the world.... except not if you are in the LC, sadly.

(it occurs to me that maybe WL was thinking about his own business ambitions more than we realise and this spilt over into his theology!)

Jesus died on the cross (apparently) because he was busy 'processing' himself, He was on his own mission. That takes the focus away from being motivated by love or the value He places in you and me. Its as if the core is gone, WL removed it.

Originally Posted by Trapped

Thanks. Do you know where Ron said that? Was that at the recent summer training or somewhere else?

Originally Posted by Cal

It's in Episode 32. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6PhHvU3v3hY

I don't know the whole context, but his point is clear. He is saying that John Ingalls was wrong for having a conscience problem with the way Philip Lee was handled. He is saying that "life" supersedes the conscience. This is not a healthy teaching.

Originally Posted by jesusislord

Can you explain in detail how the LC downplay relationship? I know as a member you can have no friends but hanging around with their members. Is that what you mean?

Originally Posted by Trapped

In a couple episodes you have mentioned Ron putting down listening to the conscience. Do you know where/when that was said and the context? Is there somewhere that could be listened to or anyone who has an excerpt of that?

Originally Posted by Curious

When you think in terms of 'Gods economy', the language of WL gives it all away. everything Cal is saying.

Originally Posted by Curious

As an outsider, its pretty obvious:
'God's economy' implies He's a businessman. A business man is trading, selling a product (the ministry), the agenda is to promote the success of His business. Persons are merely commodities in this grand business. In every business, a commodity is only of value in so far as it's earning its way to expand your business, and drawing in the customers. Otherwise it's expendable. A 'product' has no intrinsic value in itself beyond this.

When you think in terms of 'Gods economy', the language of WL gives it all away. everything Cal is saying.

I never heard the concept of God as 'Father' mentioned at any time by LCers I knew and fellowshipped with. This was an early question mark for me. The sense of the sanctity of human life is therefore not indicated, a clear aspect of Christianity that sets it apart from other religions of the world.... except not if you are in the LC, sadly.

(it occurs to me that maybe WL was thinking about his own business ambitions more than we realise and this spilt over into his theology!)

Jesus died on the cross (apparently) because he was busy 'processing' himself, He was on his own mission. That takes the focus away from being motivated by love or the value He places in you and me. Its as if the core is gone, WL removed it.

Originally Posted by IStillLoveYou!

Cal, you have a gift. Keep going with your videos as the Lord leads you, you're doing a great job and helping people with your words (Ephesians 4:29, Proverbs 12:18) at least they have helped me to better understand the LC and given me the reassurance I needed at my darkest night, I couldn't thank you enough.

God bless you and the rest of pure hearts in this forum.

Originally Posted by Cal

E36 - The Basic Problem

Showing that the basic problem of the Lord's Recovery is their valuing their "vision" more than people, and thereby making people means to the end of fulfilling that "vision," resulting in abuse.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4kfH-KlW68

Originally Posted by Indiana

Just plain excellent!

Originally Posted by Cal

E36 - The Basic Problem

Showing that the basic problem of the Lord's Recovery is their valuing their "vision" more than people, and thereby making people means to the end of fulfilling that "vision," resulting in abuse.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4kfH-KlW68

Originally Posted by Cal

Again, they focus on process rather than relationship. For example, they concern themselves more with "being transformed" and "making the kingdom" than they do with loving God and getting to know him.

Originally Posted by Curious

I hope he keeps going for as long as he feels lead to. I’ll be following them!

Originally Posted by least

hi Cal
You are one small potato. A small member in Christ just as all other members of the body of Christ.
Cal is only one of the YouTuber of The Age.
No offense.
You are 'matured' enough, by your own definition.

Originally Posted by Cal

Simply put, I'm trying to say that Lee's view of the Trinity focuses on unconcious, impersonal processes (dispensing) rather than conscious, personal relationships (persons in fellowship), and that this lends to or parallels the LR's tendency to have a warped view of relationships.

I do not know whether Lee's view of the Trinity informs his view of relationship or vice versa. But I believe there is a connection.

The word we should think of when we consider the Trinity should be "relationship" before "dispensing."

I do not believe one who truly appreciates the love between the Father and the Son, which is the Spirit, can have the cold, distant view of relationships that the LR has. That is, something is wrong with their fundamental view of God himself. Again, they focus on process rather than relationship. For example, they concern themselves more with "being transformed" and "making the kingdom" than they do with loving God and getting to know him.

Originally Posted by googlelight

That was deep Cal Ive had 8 years+ of university, and I am still struggling to comprehend what you are saying :scrat chhead:

Originally Posted by Cal

E35 - Thoughts on Witness Lee's Trinity

Considering Witness Lee's view of the Trinity, and proposing a better view.

https://youtu.be/DLAQh3_8x3E

Originally Posted by googlelight

Today I called an elderly couple I havent had fellowship with since about 2010 because they "left." I took the word of the blended brothers, something like: "they are rebellious, full of death, opposing the Lord." It was some wonderful 58 min long fellowship ended by prayer. I discovered, they are not rebellious, not full of death and they are not opposing the Lord. They are opposing a ministry that replaces Christ as the solid Rock! As soon as I dropped the seperating wall A.K.A the ministry spirit, the foundation was there right away for life-giving fellowship with my beloved brother and sister I didnt reach out to for so many years. Immediately the love of Christ could flow between members. I got a deep realization of what Paul wrote: "Accept one another, then, just as Christ accepted you (Roman 15:7!)."

Originally Posted by Cal

E32 - It's Easier to Control Others When You're a Morally Exempt God-man - "The Lord's Recovery"

Showing how "the Lord's Recovery" leaders blur right and wrong to enable their controlling of their members.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6PhHvU3v3hY

Originally Posted by Cal

E30 - shepherdingwords.com - The One Publication Edict

Examining the fact that the "the Lord's Recovery's" one publication edict proves it cannot be the "unique move of God."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WsAKFf7RXyk

Originally Posted by Cal

E27 - Witness Lee's Pasadena Rant

Looking back at Witness Lee's bizarre rant in Pasadena in 1988, where he uplifted himself up in a most inappropriate way.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4cXvByMqVrQ

Originally Posted by SeekeroftheFullTruth

The only thing I wonder about is who he is, and why he remains incognito, because I would like to send him a few questions any way to contact you brother "Cal"?

Originally Posted by Truthseeker

Yeah, I think you may go back to observe the situation in LC for a while and let us know its advance. I thought then you were Texas street preacher because your voice sounds like him.

Originally Posted by Ohio

I heard the best line ever from Cal . . .

"These guys are the most exclusive ever, they won't even be buried next to a non LCer."

.................................................. ...........

Hi Cal,

Have you done a segment on the Recovery burial ground at Grace Terrace Memorial Association in Rose Hills Memorial Park Cemetery?

Talk about fleecing the saints! LSM operates their own cemetery. They claim that you can get buried with the "holy saints" rather than with those "worldly" Christians. Anybody want to get buried next to Philip Lee? That will cost you extra.

Originally Posted by Cal

E29 - shepherdingwords.com - The Daystar Debacle - "The Lord's Recovery" Movement of Witness Lee

Examining the unethical actions of the leaders of the "the Lord's Recovery" movement of Witness Lee in the Daystar money-making scheme.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjxRkTmql34

Originally Posted by Cal

. . . unethical actions of the leaders of the "the Lord's Recovery" movement of Witness Lee in the Daystar money-making scheme.

Originally Posted by Cal

Thanks Freedom! I hope they are also short (enough) and living!

Originally Posted by Freedom

Thanks for doing these videos, they are clear and to the point.

Originally Posted by Cal

E27 - Witness Lee's Pasadena Rant

Looking back at Witness Lee's bizarre rant in Pasadena in 1988, where he uplifted himself up in a most inappropriate way.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4cXvByMqVrQ

Originally Posted by Cal

E27 - Witness Lee's Pasadena Rant

Looking back at Witness Lee's bizarre rant in Pasadena in 1988, where he uplifted himself up in a most inappropriate way.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4cXvByMqVrQ

Originally Posted by Raptor

Hi, I think it would be good to address the matter of how the leaders in the Recovery not only claim "deputy authority" but they equate their "authority" with the Old Testament authority that certain people obviously had like Moses (and not so obviously had like Noah).

The leaders in the Recovery claim that if someone disagrees or "opposes" or "rebels" against them that they will suffer God's judgment as if one rebelled vs. Moses. Yet with Moses, you had all the accompanying signs of one that represents God in the Old Testament, i.e. commanding 10 supernatural plagues, helping to save and lead all the Israelites out of Egypt, parting the Red Sea, meeting with God at Mt. Sinai, receiving the 10 commandments, guiding the Israelites through the wilderness with miraculous manna, water out of a rock, cloud during the day, fire at night, etc, etc.

Now there is a big change in the New Testament and how authority is handled. Where are the accompanying signs of the leaders in the Recovery? No signs? So how can they claim the same consequences if one "rebels" against them.....

Originally Posted by Cal

E26 - A Better Way to Determine Spiritual Authority

Examining "the Lord's Recovery's" views about determining spiritual authority and suggesting a simpler, better way.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPybhGqEuoE

Originally Posted by Truthseeker

Hey will you post it on YouTube continually? I am going to follow your channel.

Originally Posted by awareness

I agree Ohio could be the brains. He's a sharp cookie. He'd add much to your youTube channel.

Originally Posted by Cal

Ohio is the brains, I just supply the voice.

Or is it the other way around?

Originally Posted by Cal

No, that's Ohio.

Originally Posted by Cal

No, that's Ohio.

Originally Posted by Cal

No, that's Ohio.

Originally Posted by awareness

Is that your voice on the vid.?

Originally Posted by Cal

Episode #17 posted. The Hypocrisy of "the Recovery"

Belief in the principle of recovery should compel "the Lord's Recovery" to understand that people might have to leave the movement for recovery to occur.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEp1QIERgeM

Originally Posted by byHismercy

I loved the newest installment, Cal. Everything I saw is getting named. Siege Mentality indeed.

Originally Posted by Truthseeker

Yeah, I think you may go back to observe the situation in LC for a while and let us know its advance. I thought then you were Texas street preacher because your voice sounds like him.

Originally Posted by Raptor

Thanks for making those videos, keep them coming.....

Originally Posted by Cal

Yes, I went back for a while. But I've observed the group for years and followed this board, which has been a great help. I prefer some anonymity, so I'll comment through YouTube. Thanks for listening!

Originally Posted by Cal

Yes, I went back for a while. But I've observed the group for years and followed this board, which has been a great help. I prefer some anonymity, so I'll comment through YouTube. Thanks for listening!